"THIS IS THE END, MY ONLY FRIEND, THE END" -The End, by The Doors
Call it what you want humiliating, aggravating, feeling ashamed, etc. but the season once again is over early. We've come to expect World Series wins as we've come to expect breathing clean air, drinking clean water, etc.
With expectations high, we feel down, upset.
Do changes need to be made? Should changes be made? Time will tell.
I will say this. (Watching) 2006 baseball is over for me. It does not matter what happens now. I will not play the blame game. The team did not succeed. The team did not win.
I know you'll probably feel different so lets hear it.
With expectations high, we feel down, upset.
Do changes need to be made? Should changes be made? Time will tell.
I will say this. (Watching) 2006 baseball is over for me. It does not matter what happens now. I will not play the blame game. The team did not succeed. The team did not win.
I know you'll probably feel different so lets hear it.
posted by Anonymous at 7:18 PM
20 Comments:
Louis Victor Piniella. Come home, "Sweet Lou"... come back to New York.
Fuck the New York Yankees.
Keep Joe Torre.
Why keep Torre? I know there's the long, storied debate over Torre's value as a game tactician, but let's get to brass tacks about the overall condition of this ballclub, now looking back over this season and the handful of seasons before.
Save for Aaron Boone's miracle HR, we have not been a serious post-season team since 2001. The front office has made dismal choices in free agents and trades (the list is long and painful to rehash, and we all know their names by heart) and it's not entirely "Joe Torre's fault" that we have done poorly in recent years. But it is time for a regime change. Torre's currency is spent, he's done his work and now its time to get a fresh manager in there to give this team new drive and purpose.
This team has not been in control of itself for years. Our pathetic postseason in 2002, our limping into the 2003 WS, our implosion in 2004, our flaccid first-round showings in 2005 and 2006 are enough evidence for me. It's time to rebuild, and it has to come from the top-down.
The problem is the front office. We're still paying for idiotic mistakes made in 2002-03. If Torre is fired, I'm done. And I've said that before, jokingly, but I'm serious this time. I'm sick of this fucking bloated excuse for a team. We were clicking until the "dream lineup" returned. I would have rathered Sheff and Matsui lick their wounds until next year.
This article says that the inside sources are saying that Torre is gone in favor of Lou and that Steinbrenner is not going to wait long to do it so as not to miss a chance to get Pinella.
http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/baseball/story/459665p-386777c.html
You tell me a team that wins almost 100 games in the regular season can't pull off 3 out of 5? It's EVERYONE's fault, the manager, the players, the front office, the whole enchilada.
Joe, you've been a great manager through some great years, but please go home.
You see the value of a manager more clearly over the course of a season than in four games. Torre took a team that lost two franchise players early and had mediocre starting pitching and ran away with the division. This was arguably his best regular season managing performance.
And it's impossible to blame the ALDS loss on anyone but the players. The games weren't even close enough for tactical mistakes to matter. What, Lou Pinella is going to blow his stack and Sheff and Giambi are going to be more motivated and play better? Come on. We lost because we lacked depth in starting pitching and our sluggers didn't execute--again. From Randy Johnson to Carl Pavano, the front office has bet wrong on starting pitching for the last five years and it has put too much emphasis on the long ball. We know this. We've talked about it for months and we were pleased that this Yankee team seemed different. Well, the October team was not the same team that crushed Boston in August. It was the team of the previous two Octobers, with the same result.
PS: I do agree with Mark that we should go young where we can. Karstens should have a shot to make the rotation next season. Wright and Sheff should go, and maybe Mussina and A-Rod, too. Melky should be the everyday left fielder. But I stand by TAJT.
Cashman dealing for Bobby Abreu did more to sustain this team than anything Joe Torre managed. And getting a red-hot Cano back in a timely fashion made the difference. How does Torre factor into those things? Not much at all.
Fire Torre.
By your thinking the players get the credit when the Yankees succeed--a red-hot Cano and Abreu made the difference--but it's the manager's fault when those same players go cold and the Yankees fail.
That doesn't make any sense.
Without pointing to the conclusory "we didn't win" or relying on the old fallback about Torre not being able to "motivate" a team with 15 all stars and five hall of famers on it, what can you look to that suggests Torre is at fault for our ALDS meltdown?
It's not even worth arguing because he's likely to be fired anyway. Torre is a good person and he guided a great team for a long time but he has to go. I would also like to take this opportunity to thank Don Zimmer and Gene Michael for their contributions to "Joe Torre's Dynasty" of the late 1990s. Since we're heaping praise, let's spread it to the appropriate parties.
Don Zimmer? Bizarre.
Since 2002 we've come up short, and we've had a decent turnover of players during that time. We've been knocked out 3 times in the first round of the playoffs, we've gone to the World Series once to lose and we dropped a 3-0 lead to the Red Sox in a pitiful collapse. Yes, I know I said its not worth debating it, but the reason I say these things is because it is not reasonable to say Joe Torre has had his chances with this team and now its time for a change. As for specific things Joe Torre did to hurt this year's team, I think that's an impossibl question to answer. I could easily ask "What did Torre NOT do that hurt this team's chances?" Evaluating Torre under a microscope is not the issue, and as I've said before the whole orgainization should be blamed for this failure. That being said, let's get a new skipper and move forward because Joe Torre's legacy has changed from post-season golden boy to an expressionaless potted plant.
I mention Zimm because there is a prevailing theory that he was instrumental in making tactical decisions for Torre while he was bench coach. If true, then Zimm did a magnificent job.
I would hardly call that the "prevailing theory" on Don Zimmer's role with the Yankees.
Torre has taken an incredible amount of bashing in the media from both the press and big stein. And I'm sick of this idea that spending 200M somehow should guarantee a championship. At least 100M is wasted on has beens or never quite good enoughs like randy, sheffield, giambi, mussina, wright, and farnsworth. How can you blame jeter for this? He and posada are the only two guys who showed up. (and wang) Also, do you think cano, melky cabrera, scott proctor, and wang just came out of nowhere. No, Joe and his staff helped develop these guys. If the yanks were going to fire joe for someone good, I'd be less angry and upset. But piniella? He's a piece of turd. Love the job in tampa. You think arod is cracked up now? Imagine under sweet lou's leadership.
If anything, joe has been at his best the past 2 seasons. Its a five game series folks, and detroit is probably going to win the world series. While we're at it, why not fire billy beane? His teams didn't get the job done in the postseason until now or ron gardenhire in minnesota. What a garbage manager he is since the twins have lost 3 out of 4 first rounders.
I think Mark is absolutely right. It is a time to question everything. But as we question, some guys are going to come out of it better than others. Jeter comes out blameless, of course. As for Joe, he, along with the front office, puts his team in a position to win the championship every year, and there is something to be said for that. But in a short series the players must execute. There is no next day or next week in a five game series. If Joe were making tactical mistakes and we were losing close games due to them, I'd probably be with you. But we were out of these games in the third and fourth inning. We have a lineup of all stars who didn't score for 19 or 20 straight innings. That's not tactical. So after all the bluster, the major critcism seems to be that Joe doesn't motivate the Yankees. He's a "potted plant," as Adam says. I think you guys just want someone who looks like they're doing something. You want a manager who is going to kick dirt on an umpire every few weeks to let you know he's alive. Well, that's fine for the fans, but all that nonsense is irrelevant for a team like the Yankees.
A player who cares can get motivated sitting in the shower thinking about the game. Hell, I could get excited about a chess match two days beforehand if I know it's going to be a battle. It doesn't take rah rah silliness. I think you guys have seen too many movies.
You want to know how to fix the Yankees? Get a good fourth starter and give Joe a lineup that he can manage, not seven sluggers.
Dan, good point.
This Tiger team is very good. It's pitching staff is similiar to the great Yankee teams, minus Rivera. I'm hoping they go all the way.
I'm rooting for the Tigers for the rest of this postseason.
I like detroit too. Certainly more than the sox of the last 2 years, and more than the As. I can only imagine how much toady joe buck and mccarver will fellate billy beane if the As win, and thus prove that moneyball is amazing.
If folks want to fire torre, you gotta give me something better than lou piniella. Let joe finsih his contract and hire scioscia in 2008 after he gets fired. Or let donnie take over. Piniella will be a 3rd place disaster, because he'll gas our pitchers even worse than torre and antagonize arod even more. Its not 1995 anynore folks.
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